[silence] Messiaen & Cage

[Rob Haskins]

I think that the idea of "anti-organization" in Cage is very misleading.  It makes people assume that there is no organization at all, whereas I think what Cage was after was to produce a kind of organization that wouldn't lead listeners to experience one and the same organization, but instead discover many possible organizations worthy of their attention.  

Rob
 
Rob Haskins
Assistant Professor of Music
University of New Hampshire
rob_haskins@yahoo.com
http://robhaskins.net
"Heroism doesn't consist in brilliantly combatting someone else. . . .  What is heroic is to accept the situation in which you find yourself."  -- John Cage




----- Original Message ----
From: Carl Heppenstall <Heppenstall_at_KC@msn.com>
To: silence@list.mail.virginia.edu
Sent: Monday, April 2, 2007 1:12:14 AM
Subject: Re: [silence] Messiaen & Cage



 




Ralph, Very interesting.  

 

Generally, the organization and nature of the organization probably 
interests me more than a purposeful lack of organization, but in the end, 
however the music is created, it must reflect our chaotic or "un-conscious" 
interaction with the natural stillness of the universe for me to enjoy it.  
Often we get so caught up in the technical mastery of what is getting created 
and we lose one of the purposes of art - creating music that can reach 
the soul.  

 

Cage did his work at getting us to listen to the natural stillness and the 
space and things interacting with and underlying our consciousness, but once 
that mission was accomplished, why do we need to continue to create similar art 
that merely points to the thing but is not reflective of the thing?

 

Best Regards,

Carl

 


  ----- Original Message ----- 

  From: Ralph Lichtensteiger 

  To: silence@list.mail.virginiaedu 
  

  Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2007 11:54 
  PM

  Subject: [silence] Messiaen & 
  Cage

  

Dear silencers, 
  thank you all for your great comments about Messiaen & 
  Cage.

  They are very helpful and inciting for me. Thanks a lot !

  The antagonism (antithesis) Cage / Messiaen opens a wide range of 
  interesting thoughts.

  


  "Natural sounds suggest music to us, but are not yet themselves music… 
  Tonal elements become music only by virtue of their being organized, and that 
  such organization presupposes a conscious human act." — Igor Stravinsky: 
  Poetics of Music, Harvard University Press, 1942, S. 23

  


  in opposition to Cage's "anti-organization" of sound.

  


  Kind regards,

  ralph lichtensteiger

  http://del.icio.us/lichtconlon

  http://time4time.blogspot.com/

  http://www.lichtensteiger.de/

  


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