[silence] Aesthetics

[Carl Heppenstall]

When I contemplate being "susceptible to divine influences", I do not think of those negative things cited.  I think of becoming aware of the beauty of the world - Divine might = love. Those religious things cited are = fear.  So the two motives are seeking those divine influences, a positive effort, looking for the good, or seeking to not have intention, negative in the lack of effort, which may indeed point you to the good.

 




From: loco.nordin@mbox200.swipnet.se
To: mitchellrenner@msn.com
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 15:51:46 +0100
CC: silence@list.mail.virginia.edu
Subject: Re: [silence] Aesthetics

"Divine influences" seem to mean - to most people here - something good. I wonder why that is. Do you automatically presuppose that gods are good? Look into Greek mythology, and you'll find that that isn't always so. Or look into the Bible and find the rivers of blood flowing, for example from the little boys that ridiculed a bald man; even stark for the most hardheaded of today, don't you think? And, hey, look at the world! Left by God, or run by him/her/it? And if God is the same as The Universe, then WE are God, since there is absolutely NO difference, at "core" level, between us and anything else; just energy quanta.
The other matter, of non-intention, was, of course, a way for Cage to try to get as far away as practically possible from letting his own personality or preferences come in the way of the sounds; of the music. Is that negative??? I think it's both humble and truly positively experimental!
Loco

19 feb 2009 kl. 21.00 skrev MITCHELL RENNER:I couldn't help but laugh at this one, as my memory fails me, and it seems like gibberish on my part.  Let's see...

In the earlier interviews and media references I came across studying Cage's life several years ago, it seemed that the aspect of non-intentionality or non-purpose was mentioned more than the aspect of sobering and quieting the mind for receptiveness to divine influence.  That was somewhat startling for me, because I didn't think you could understand Cage's music without realizing both aspects.  People were clamoring about this music which had no purpose at all (the negative), but absolutely, it had a purpose, as did 4'33" and all of Cage's works (to renunciate in order to be susceptible, to be empty in order to be receptive...).  One can choose to view only the negative, but there was a positive aspect as well, and I was always surprised when the one was mentioned and not the other.  But, isn't that typical of media - to get it all wrong, and emphasize only a one-sided view of life, which ultimately can only be viewed subjectively?

It would be interesting to know if Cage said anything about these ideals towards the end of his life; if they changed, remained with him, or maybe were subsumed to the point of not thinking much at all about them.  Certainly they were powerful moral and aesthetic compasses in his work, and a reason why his work will continue to be of interest to others.

Mystics live longer than others in that way.

>I pondered this for several minutes and determined that "being >susceptible to divine influences" is surely positive, and having a lack >of purpose is either negative or is depressing, but together, they >seem to be very beneficial, both of them.
>
>Regards,
>Carl
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: silence-bounces@list.mail.virginia.edu
> [mailto:silence-bounces@list.mail.virginia.edu] On Behalf Of Glenn
> Freeman
> Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009 3:47 PM
> To: silence@list.mail.virginia.edu
> Subject: Re: [silence] Aesthetics
> 
> ok. which one is which?
> 
> Mitchell Renner wrote:
> 
> > In my studies of Cage, I realized two main stated purposes - one, 
> of non-intentionality or lack of purpose, as you mention;
> > and two, "to sober and quiet the mind, thus making it susceptible 
> to divine influences." (from Coomaraswamy)
> > Notice one is a negative and one a positive.
> 
> Glenn Freeman

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